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Ruben Zadkovich leaves Roar

On Zadkovich's football I disagree.

We were bad at it, but he had us playing attractive, positive football that generated chances we were unable to put away. I don't think anyone believes we were close to being winners and no-one calling on bad luck as behind our woes - but we were competitive without having the final finish and close losers in most games.

Having Abubakar come in at the end with the ability to finish off some of our chances showed what we might have been playing like if we had a resilient defence and someone like Abubakar from the start.

Ruben picked the squad to some extent, so that sits on him fair enough. Just not the dross football you saw in my eyes.
Nah, you can't give him credit for the very few good things, but absolve him of blame for the shit things. We were not playing positive or attractive football. I'm going to disagree on this. The ladder does not lie. I watched so many games where the tactics were so dragging and poor. It was not ideal to watch.

I'm not buying this revisionism that Zadkovich had us playing good football and was just a small bit away from having the finished product. He came to us with a 21% success rate. It's not A-league standard. He leaves with a 14% success. It's not beneficial at all.
 
He definitely seemed to improve as the season went on

However, we don't have clear pathways to grassroots coaches. So we usually just hire former players who do the education rather than a formal talent system where people can move up the ranks
Need bigger pathways so the clubs can trust the coaching talent outside of the aleague.

The Championship should help, I’m intrigued whether if they are coaches on that level that never has been given the chance to coach in the aleague due to the lack of profile compared to former aleague players?
 
It looks like an interesting appointment, coaching experience in the Netherlands, Belgium, Israel and in turkey whilst being the assistant with the Greek national team so he doesn’t lack in experience.

The Roar need to get it right, it’s too big of a market for them to be towards the bottom of the table each season.
 
I can't believe this. Why sack him now??

He was actually getting results.
Even earlier in the season they were in most games and introduced a few quality young players into the team and gave them regular football.

I'd be unhappy with this if i was a roar supporter.
 
I can't believe this. Why sack him now??

He was actually getting results.
Even earlier in the season they were in most games and introduced a few quality young players into the team and gave them regular football.

I'd be unhappy with this if i was a roar supporter.
You'd be unhappy as roar supporter just for waking up.

Seen a lot of talk he didn't get along with the youngsters we saw brazete in tears when he got subbed on them off last game
 
I can't believe this. Why sack him now??

He was actually getting results.
Even earlier in the season they were in most games and introduced a few quality young players into the team and gave them regular football.

I'd be unhappy with this if i was a roar supporter.
No he was crap. Only got some results at the end of the season mostly against lower teams in games that didn't matter (Perth, Wellington, Mariners) and/or in poor form (Adelaide - even then only a home draw). Only win against a top team was the win v WU, even then that was the first home win in over a year. One clean sheet for the season, in the second last game. Defensively always looked likely to (and many times did) concede sloppy goals.
 
No he was crap. Only got some results at the end of the season mostly against lower teams in games that didn't matter (Perth, Wellington, Mariners) and/or in poor form (Adelaide - even then only a home draw). Only win against a top team was the win v WU, even then that was the first home win in over a year. One clean sheet for the season, in the second last game. Defensively always looked likely to (and many times did) concede sloppy goals.
I accept the head coach gets and deserves whatever comes from results, but I think the players deserve flack for not being able to finish what they created from following the coaches instructions - be it conceding the weakest of goals time and again through poor decision making, focus or positioning or missing a goal when we had worked to set the opportunity up well.

The style of play was good in my opinion - other than unsuccessfully closing up shop when we went a goal up. We played forward and with positive intent which is something that has been absent for some time. Our combinations bringing the ball out under pressure were often a joy to behold.

Zadkovich chose the defenders and attackers we had so that sits on him for his player selection but the actual way we played in terms of the system was something that I was happy with as it progressed over a very long and painful season.
 
I think there is a revisionism around Zadkovich. I keep seeing that the style of play was good, but if that was the case, the results would be different. Can't just say that the players were shit because that comes down to Zadkovich too. He picks the team, he recruited the players. He should have been able to identify this and sign the players who would have been the best of it.

The Roar is a bit like United, shit management and ownership and it seeps down through to the football side. Until new owners come in, we are going to struggle. Valkanis does not fill me with confidence. His managerial record is crap, but obviously need to give him a chance
 
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I think there is a revisionism around Zadkovich. I keep seeing that the style of play was good, but if that was the case, the results would be different. Can't just say that the players were shit because that comes down to Zadkovich too. He picks the team, he recruited the players. He should have been able to identify this and sign the players who would have been the best of it.

The Roar is a bit like United, shit management and ownership and it seeps down through to the football side. Until new owners come in, we are going to struggle. Valkanis does not fill me with confidence. His managerial record is crap, but obviously need to give him a chance
Your first paragraph seems to be exactly what I said in my response to keeper66, except I disagree that the style of play dictates results.

I know from watching that as the season developed we got better at close passing in pressure situations and with the cohesion and vision resulting in more and better chances. We were able to pass through, around and over a press, looked for and found passes that were positive rather than purely defensive, and we made runs into space that often received a pass. That is what I call the style of our football and I found it entertaining and exciting - something to be proud of in the moments that we could see what Zadkovich was trying to achieve.

The 'strikers' Zadkovich had chosen until Hore's return and Abubakar's signing were more attacking forwards and not strikers as far as I am concerned. They got into position, generally speaking, without 'instinctively' going there, were often reactive rather than anticipating a chance, and sprayed the ball high or wide frequently instead of having a clinical finish.

Brazete, Burke-Gilroy, and Herrington all had good seasons under Zadkovich. Berenguer was playing much better football for the last 5 or so games and the cohesion among players was a big part of that as Zadkovich mixed and matched too often for my liking early on trying to make the parts magically come together. Ludwik and Shour looked to be decent signings.

I liked Zabala being played further forward and he turned out to be quite effective at it.

I don't think we saw anything near the best that Jelacic can bring to a team (whether it is him or the team not living up to his capability), and Warland, Van der Saag, Struick, Zimarino and Halloran were all less than successful choices. Bility is well documented for his strengths and sometimes dire weaknesses - but he did improve with the exposure. On paper there is a chance that all those players could have worked out and when they didn't I don't think Zadkovich had the money to change them for something better.

Even though Waddingham was borderline with his accuracy and could be wasteful with his touch at times he was a part of Zadkovich's choices and grew into the part under him. Well enough that he was sold as a result of what he showed - have to give credit for Ruben there because if you say that it was just Waddingham then you can't argue that bad players are the coaches fault. Some of Zadkovich's selections were awful but equally some were solid and even brilliant.

When we hear and read that Zadkovich could only buy Abubakar after he had sold Waddingham it tells us that he was operating on a very limited budget - so his options when he discovered that players were not working out were equally limited.

Watching throughout the season, we played defensively and limited our own attacking chances early on. Results that were close were more us shutting up shop to limit our opponents opportunities than us playing on the edge of success. As the season progressed and Zadkovich mixed and matched to give players every chance of working out he weaned the playing group down to the ones that worked best and towards the end of the season we evolved into the team that we could be. That whole evolution through seemingly endless chances for underperforming players to the final series of games was Zadkovich coaching with the players he had selected.

I would say that the results did not match the style of play and potential under Ruben as many neutral observers commented on during the whole season. We were not playing that badly in their 'expert' eyes. For me, we leaked easy goals at some point in most games and failed to take our few good chances at the other end. The style of play was not to blame for the results unless you would argue that the player selection did not match the intended style well enough - and on that we might agree.

The owners have a lot to answer for. Ruben, with all his strengths and weaknesses, wears the obvious fallout.

I would have liked for Ruben to have the time and resources to prove himself with a stable and improved squad but that cannot happen at our club and results are the metric that rules when it comes down to it.

Not revisionism in my eyes - a genuine journey of trial and progression as the season unfolded.
 
Your first paragraph seems to be exactly what I said in my response to keeper66, except I disagree that the style of play dictates results.

I know from watching that as the season developed we got better at close passing in pressure situations and with the cohesion and vision resulting in more and better chances. We were able to pass through, around and over a press, looked for and found passes that were positive rather than purely defensive, and we made runs into space that often received a pass. That is what I call the style of our football and I found it entertaining and exciting - something to be proud of in the moments that we could see what Zadkovich was trying to achieve.

The 'strikers' Zadkovich had chosen until Hore's return and Abubakar's signing were more attacking forwards and not strikers as far as I am concerned. They got into position, generally speaking, without 'instinctively' going there, were often reactive rather than anticipating a chance, and sprayed the ball high or wide frequently instead of having a clinical finish.

Brazete, Burke-Gilroy, and Herrington all had good seasons under Zadkovich. Berenguer was playing much better football for the last 5 or so games and the cohesion among players was a big part of that as Zadkovich mixed and matched too often for my liking early on trying to make the parts magically come together. Ludwik and Shour looked to be decent signings.

I liked Zabala being played further forward and he turned out to be quite effective at it.

I don't think we saw anything near the best that Jelacic can bring to a team (whether it is him or the team not living up to his capability), and Warland, Van der Saag, Struick, Zimarino and Halloran were all less than successful choices. Bility is well documented for his strengths and sometimes dire weaknesses - but he did improve with the exposure. On paper there is a chance that all those players could have worked out and when they didn't I don't think Zadkovich had the money to change them for something better.

Even though Waddingham was borderline with his accuracy and could be wasteful with his touch at times he was a part of Zadkovich's choices and grew into the part under him. Well enough that he was sold as a result of what he showed - have to give credit for Ruben there because if you say that it was just Waddingham then you can't argue that bad players are the coaches fault. Some of Zadkovich's selections were awful but equally some were solid and even brilliant.

When we hear and read that Zadkovich could only buy Abubakar after he had sold Waddingham it tells us that he was operating on a very limited budget - so his options when he discovered that players were not working out were equally limited.

Watching throughout the season, we played defensively and limited our own attacking chances early on. Results that were close were more us shutting up shop to limit our opponents opportunities than us playing on the edge of success. As the season progressed and Zadkovich mixed and matched to give players every chance of working out he weaned the playing group down to the ones that worked best and towards the end of the season we evolved into the team that we could be. That whole evolution through seemingly endless chances for underperforming players to the final series of games was Zadkovich coaching with the players he had selected.

I would say that the results did not match the style of play and potential under Ruben as many neutral observers commented on during the whole season. We were not playing that badly in their 'expert' eyes. For me, we leaked easy goals at some point in most games and failed to take our few good chances at the other end. The style of play was not to blame for the results unless you would argue that the player selection did not match the intended style well enough - and on that we might agree.

The owners have a lot to answer for. Ruben, with all his strengths and weaknesses, wears the obvious fallout.

I would have liked for Ruben to have the time and resources to prove himself with a stable and improved squad but that cannot happen at our club and results are the metric that rules when it comes down to it.

Not revisionism in my eyes - a genuine journey of trial and progression as the season unfolded.
You are saying a lot without saying much. There is a lot about certain players doing certain things and being good at what they are doing, but the reality is that the results say a completely different story. It's like when clubs say they bossed possession but they lost the match. What's the more important part?

Every Roar manager has worked on a tight budget for the last decade or so, but some had better success than others. Zadkovich just didn't cut it at this level. If he was able to have a clear vision for what he wanted, then he needed to build a team around that. The fact that you are able to identify areas in which he didn't have the players he needed suggests that he failed to recruit properly.

There was no progression until the last 4/5 games, which by then is too late. It needed to happen earlier and it wasn't doing so. So to come out and say that Zadkovich needed more time because he was getting them playing good football is revisionism. It's taken a small subset of success and suggesting it would be greater success particularly when all the metrics suggest otherwise.

All well and good to pass a ball into space and find the right players, but it comes down to what you do with the ball, and what the Roar did was very little.
 
I think there is a revisionism around Zadkovich. I keep seeing that the style of play was good, but if that was the case, the results would be different. Can't just say that the players were shit because that comes down to Zadkovich too. He picks the team, he recruited the players. He should have been able to identify this and sign the players who would have been the best of it.

The Roar is a bit like United, shit management and ownership and it seeps down through to the football side. Until new owners come in, we are going to struggle. Valkanis does not fill me with confidence. His managerial record is crap, but obviously need to give him a chance
I agree with your post except for the "he recruited the players" bit which I don't agree with. All clubs have contracted players and when the coach arrives he is handed those players as per contractual agreement. New recruits by and large are the responsibility of the new coach. I am assuming that he went after Halloran, Warland and Zamarino for reasons known only to himself. Personally he would have been better off scouting U20s from other clubs.
 
You are saying a lot without saying much. There is a lot about certain players doing certain things and being good at what they are doing, but the reality is that the results say a completely different story. It's like when clubs say they bossed possession but they lost the match. What's the more important part?

Every Roar manager has worked on a tight budget for the last decade or so, but some had better success than others. Zadkovich just didn't cut it at this level. If he was able to have a clear vision for what he wanted, then he needed to build a team around that. The fact that you are able to identify areas in which he didn't have the players he needed suggests that he failed to recruit properly.

There was no progression until the last 4/5 games, which by then is too late. It needed to happen earlier and it wasn't doing so. So to come out and say that Zadkovich needed more time because he was getting them playing good football is revisionism. It's taken a small subset of success and suggesting it would be greater success particularly when all the metrics suggest otherwise.

All well and good to pass a ball into space and find the right players, but it comes down to what you do with the ball, and what the Roar did was very little.
I said a lot because there are a lot of elements that make up a review of a manager in my eyes - not just the results.

That you choose not to rate those elements in favour of the black and white results as your overriding assessment criteria is how you choose to see it instead. I can live with that.

The results say exactly what I spelled out in all those words - we leaked at the back at some point in most games and failed to score after creating opportunities at the other end. Everything that happened on the pitch between those failings also forms part of Zadkovich's success or failure as a coach though - which included a lot of good, some experimental madness at times, and some horrible stuff too.

Yes, it is exactly like when a club says they bossed possession but lost the match. I do not think I suggested otherwise. I also did not suggest that I was happy with how we ended up on the table or with how we played outright. But I can dislike that and still see value and good in the season under Zadkovich.

The point of difference is that I choose to view, and have always viewed, our progression from game to game in small increments of promise rather than being driven down by the simple fact of poor results. As the season progressed we had more of those moments and to me there has been a definite progression throughout the season, albeit painfully slow, until the final games when it produced results - again admittedly against the teams in our immediate vicinity at the bottom of the table.

I did not say Zadkovich needed more time - I said "I would have liked for Ruben to have the time and resources to prove himself with a stable and improved squad but that cannot happen at our club and results are the metric that rules when it comes down to it.". I stand by that. I would love for Ruben to have financial freedom to choose players, build a squad, keep the best the following season and improve on it. I would love for that to be possible to see how he would go. It isn't a realistic idea but it does not change the fact that I would like to see what Ruben can do under the best circumstances. He might turn out to be crap or he may work wonders - I have seen enough to wonder.

As for our history of budget conscious managers, I think Zadkovich has had the worst of it in the last decade or so. Ange and his immediate successors had the benefit of pre-Bakkries options with an eroding player base over time that held some quality for awhile. Looking at the squad all the way down to John Aloisi we are not talking about a similar budget to Zadkovich by any means. Fowler got to build his squad as he wanted and again his immediate successors had the benefit of those players brought in until probably Warren Moon saw the last of them off. It looks pretty clear to me that Zadkovich has inherited the bulk of his squad on relatively low salaries and has had the most restrictive spending of any coach so far. I have not seen the accounts, but just look at the players over the years and you can see that has to be true.

I did say he had failed to recruit well enough. You must have missed that part.

In black and white terms Zadkovich failed to produce results at this level, but it would be some awfully blinkered eyes that saw no good in his managing at all and could not see that the style of football we were trying to play was worth watching.
 
Yer no need for long sermons - he’s was a lightweight as a player and coach even lighter imo.
PG finished around the same mid to lower table where they been previous seasons - not much to see here.
 
Yer no need for long sermons - he’s was a lightweight as a player and coach even lighter imo.
PG finished around the same mid to lower table where they been previous seasons - not much to see here.
He he hee - they were called discussions in the dinosaur era before single sentence multimedia forums ruled the world ;).

You must understand, young Hobbit, it takes a long time to say anything in Old Entish. And we never say anything unless it is worth taking a long time to say.
 
He he hee - they were called discussions in the dinosaur era before single sentence multimedia forums ruled the world ;).

You must understand, young Hobbit, it takes a long time to say anything in Old Entish. And we never say anything unless it is worth taking a long time to say.
you mad, one eyed bastard, I love how passionate you are about your club....... .
 
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