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Playing football with the original 13 rules

HappyGuus said:
Yeah Aussie/Victorian/Melbourne Rules wasn't really invented, it was largely copied from already existing rules of various codes. But let them believe it's special or indigenous.
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specifically Gaelic Football, hence the ‘International Rules’ malarkey between the two codes.

And the fact remains that most ball-games played by First Nations Australians prior to&after European colonisation would’ve more closely resembled ⚽️ than any variation of 🏉..
 
BA81 said:
specifically Gaelic Football, hence the ‘International Rules’ malarkey between the two codes.

And the fact remains that most ball-games played by First Nations Australians prior to&after European colonisation would’ve more closely resembled ⚽️ than any variation of 🏉..
Click to expand...
Yeah those two games are interesting debates themselves. I've seen some Gaelic football experts claim that they copied the Melbourne rules almost word for word. And I agree with you there about Marngrook, all the old articles I've read from the 1800s suggest they were closer to Cambridge or Sheffield rules rather than Melbourne. Having said that, most of the Melbourne rules were from soccer, as was gridiron. Rugby similar.

Is soccer we still say "it's gone behind for a corner/goal kick". It was the same in Aussie rules, and they played on rectangles with round balls. They used to have the same scoring, 1 point for a goal and nothing for "behind". My memory might be hazey on this part, but I think they then started awarding 1 point for every six behinds, this then got changed to six points for a goal and one point for a behind.

Funny thing in gridiron, it was the same rules and scoring as soccer. Then they brought in tries for one point, but goals were worth four! Today that's flipped, touchdowns are worth more than the goals.
 
Even the AFL's official history doesn't link Marngrook with Australian Rules.

Just some fantasy some clown invented to try and justify the 'relevance' to Australians as it's 'national game'.
 
HappyGuus said:
Yeah those two games are interesting debates themselves. I've seen some Gaelic football experts claim that they copied the Melbourne rules almost word for word. And I agree with you there about Marngrook, all the old articles I've read from the 1800s suggest they were closer to Cambridge or Sheffield rules rather than Melbourne. Having said that, most of the Melbourne rules were from soccer, as was gridiron. Rugby similar.

Is soccer we still say "it's gone behind for a corner/goal kick". It was the same in Aussie rules, and they played on rectangles with round balls. They used to have the same scoring, 1 point for a goal and nothing for "behind". My memory might be hazey on this part, but I think they then started awarding 1 point for every six behinds, this then got changed to six points for a goal and one point for a behind.

Funny thing in gridiron, it was the same rules and scoring as soccer. Then they brought in tries for one point, but goals were worth four! Today that's flipped, touchdowns are worth more than the goals.
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I read, and it may not be true, that a 'try' was from the fact that crossing the line gave you a 'try' at kicking a goal because a 'try' wasn't worth anything back in the day only goals.
 
ChatGPT agrees.

Background:​

Originally, the term "try" comes from the idea that grounding the ball over the opponent’s goal line allowed a team to "try" for a kick at goal, which was the only way to score points in the early game. A try itself didn't have any point value — it just gave you the opportunity to kick for a goal, which did count.

Key Milestones:
  • Before 1875: Only goals counted for points. A try gave the right to "try" a conversion kick.
  • 1875: Tries started being counted to decide a winner in drawn matches (when goals were equal).
  • 1886: The International Rugby Football Board (IRFB) was formed and began standardizing the scoring.
  • 1891: The IRFB made a try worth 1 point — the first time it had intrinsic value.
  • 1893: The value was increased to 3 points.
    • 1971: 4 points
    • 1992: 5 points (still the current value)

Let me know if you'd like a full table of point values over time.
 
Muz said:
Even the AFL's official history doesn't link Marngrook with Australian Rules.

Just some fantasy some clown invented to try and justify the 'relevance' to Australians as it's 'national game'.
Click to expand...
Yep. Growing up with AFL in the 90s, they were pushing the link heavily back then. Since the internet and newspaper archives have come online, they gone very quiet about it.
 
AFL fanatics are furious and outraged if you suggest that aussie rules is based on an English game that Tom Wills brought to Melbourne.
"But its Australia's own game, we invented it etc, etc".

Marngrook however has been labelled a myth by some historians. Can you imagine white colonials agreeing to play by aboriginal rules? They would not have had a bar of them.
 
Always thought from my early days and recollections afl was a hybrid of Gaelic football period.
Nothing re First Nations that I recall.
As for for gridiron anything re football/soccer never heard that till reading here unbelievable.
Rugby yes was its its origins and fine tuned merican way.
 
There was no Gaelic football influence in aussie rules-early footy in Melbourne was played by middle class blokes.
 
Ok got it fellas
Showed my ignorance being a northerner thank Christ :)
I googled and and as mentioned through some posts I found below :
(Damn mugs game I tell you)

  • Australian Rules Football's Origins:
    The game emerged in Melbourne, with the first organized games played around 1858. It was influenced by various sources:
  • Gaelic Football's Development:
    While Gaelic football was also evolving in Ireland, it's suggested that the sport may have been influenced by the Australian game, particularly after Irish immigrants brought the Australian Rules back to Ireland.

  • Similarities and Differences:
    Both games share certain features like hand-passing, a scoring system, and the need to bounce the ball while running. However, they also have distinct rules and characteristics. For example, Australian Rules has "behind posts" and a scoring system that differs from Gaelic football
 
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